tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post7571764114561592096..comments2023-11-02T03:08:07.417-07:00Comments on NephiCode: Legends of the Book of Mormon – Part IDelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comBlogger55125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-47599059000013384192022-01-23T14:58:41.108-08:002022-01-23T14:58:41.108-08:00North America has the most: Genetics, archeology, ...North America has the most: Genetics, archeology, and legends. <br /><br />South America is absolutely the least. There is no evidence of any civilization matching the Jaredite and Nephite timeline. South America is basically silent during that era. Central America rise and fall of civilizations is opposite of the Book of Mormon (i.e. Mayans rise when the Nephites would end). North America (Copper Complex, Adena, Hopewell) match it perfectly, especially since the Nephites did not build their cities out of cut stone, but out or wood and earthen mounds.Genealogy and Genetics Amateurhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10096205653750915605noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-49187882431036040712019-01-30T10:38:52.322-08:002019-01-30T10:38:52.322-08:00You are using my picture of Zelph and Onandagus wi...You are using my picture of Zelph and Onandagus without permission. You may use it if you link to my website at worksofjoseph.comRianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11013039229657311399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-5227486336989394912017-05-25T10:03:58.097-07:002017-05-25T10:03:58.097-07:00I repeat, the Malay Peninsula was known as the isl...I repeat, the Malay Peninsula was known as the island of Qumr or Komr until at least the 15th century AD. It was known as an island, and it very well could have been an island as the sea levels were 2 meters higher between the time of the Jaredites and the the time of the Lehites. There are numerous accounts of the peninsula being an island many centuries ago. Another interesteing coincidence is that the Island of Komr was also called Djezer or Dsrt (Deseret) in Arabic texts. <br /><br />https://www.evernote.com/l/AAiuxipYB9RA_LwficKdFZqjy151MysVEJE<br /><br />There are no accounts of Chile and Ecuador being an island. I think your model has merit, but the biggest problem I see is that South America was not island at any time between 2500 BC and 420 AD. It does not match 2 Nephi 10:20. I understand your argument is that the world is around 6000-7000 years old, but there is no evidence of this being true. The Malay Peninsula matches, and there are many accounts of it being an island during the Book of Mormon period.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-57723868891647553572017-05-25T09:31:33.507-07:002017-05-25T09:31:33.507-07:00Since there is almost nothing to tie these togethe...Since there is almost nothing to tie these together later on, i.e., Malay Peninsula does not match the scriptural record which is about a settlement on an island (2 Nephi 10:20) not a peninsula, why is it you continue to try and combine two separate things when so many prophets have written about various people being led away to different parts of the world as described in my comment earlier. All you are doing is showing that two separate groups were led away, which is verified by numerous scriptural references. You do not show connections in those two groups later on except through name connections.Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-55900904017498299742017-05-25T00:24:38.330-07:002017-05-25T00:24:38.330-07:00Arabic texts tell of a Biblical group called the Q...Arabic texts tell of a Biblical group called the Qumr who sailed east in boats resembling Noah's Ark around the time of the tower. These people lived in tents in a place called Qumr. <br /><br />The Book of Ether tells of a Biblical group led by Mahonri Moriancumer who sailed east in boats resembling Noah's Ark around the time of the tower. These people also lived in tents in a place called Moriancumer or Morian cumr. <br /><br />Do you not find these two accounts to be remarkably similar?Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-10613914468469109372017-05-25T00:22:12.812-07:002017-05-25T00:22:12.812-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-52073718157545603792017-05-24T11:13:05.530-07:002017-05-24T11:13:05.530-07:00Unknown: You wrote: "Sorry, I'm not follo...Unknown: You wrote: "Sorry, I'm not following. Moriancumer is mentioned in Ether 2:13. I am referring to Moriancumer as a toponym, and comparing it to the toponym given to an island/peninsula in the Malay Archipelago. I realize Joseph Smith said it was also the name of the Brother of Jared, so I accept it can also be used as a personal name/title. But its usage in the Book of Mormon is as a location, most likely on the east coast of Asia (according to Nibley). I agree, and I think there is evidence of this in the identification made by Arabic geographers of a location called Qumr in the Far East."<br /><br />In the Book of Mormon place names (toponym) are almost always the result of the name of an individual - We do not know that the Jaredites followed this pattern, but some evidences suggest they might have. On the other hand, you were using Morian cumr has a double name when my response showed it was not and the mistake was corrected and the full name is Mahonri Moriancumer, which leads to the naming of the land along the seashore is most likelyh an eopnym or eponymous since the second name was the one used. It would not be unlikely for the Jaredites to name the area after the man who talked with God, was led by God, to this beautiful land. That is speculation, but has more to do with the Book of Mormon than does your Cumr connection.Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-31974796716099418342017-05-22T11:07:06.348-07:002017-05-22T11:07:06.348-07:00"in that part of the world Qamar is a variant..."in that part of the world Qamar is a variant of Qumr"<br /><br />They are two distinct words. Qamar is Arabic for "moon" and we don't know the origins of the word Qumr. Ibn Sa'id claimed it was the name of the Biblical clan that sailed east around the time of the tower. But he was clear that it was not pronounced the same as Qamar, for moon. Two different words. <br /><br />https://www.evernote.com/l/AAhyhtXqB5ZLOo_nwIcvYTlihfiX7Xld2yE<br /><br />I do understand that sometimes unrelated words can be spelled the same or pronounced the same. That is to be expected. But when two words are pronounced the same and also have the same meaning, then it is more likely that they are related. In this case both Qumr and Cumr seem to be connected to a Biblical group that migrated east in boats resembling Noah's Ark around the time of the tower. I just offer this as one piece of evidence that the Book of Mormon gets the history correct. Again, if you don't like the Malay model, that's perfectly fine. This evidence is independent of any Book of Mormon geography model.<br />Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-78838112017333451592017-05-22T08:57:10.490-07:002017-05-22T08:57:10.490-07:00Perhaps I have not followed your train of thought ...Perhaps I have not followed your train of thought very well, since I was under the impression that your remarks dealt with Malay--and in that part of the world Qamar is a variant of Qumr, and it was you using such words to create a tie in and I was pointing out that a tie in does not in all cases and cited an example. If you have read as much as you say, then you know we have here discussed those similar sounding names before in connection to the Lehi party and Southeast Asia. In addition, since you were using names of people, my comment about Moriancumer is correct--the Book of Mormon does not use that word in connection to a name. On the other hand, thanks to Joseph Smith's explanation of that name, we now can pretty conclusively suggest that the area along the shore was called Moriancumer after the name of the Brother of Jared. Also, since Moriancumer was named Mahonri Moriancumer, and the printing error of Morian cumer is explained, the Cumr you mention seems to hold no water since that name or term is not used in the scriptural record except in connection with Moriancumer's full name. Also, if you haven't read my explanation of who the Jaredites were, i.e., which brother Jared was and which Moriancumer was, as found in the second book "Who Really Settled Mesoamerica," it might help you to better understand "from whence they came" which you seem to have a problem understanding--it is certainly as valid as your name connections and probably more so since we are dealing with Biblical and Book of Mormon names. Lastly, I will repeat once again that the Lord has said he leads people away from time to time--that he has led others out of the House of Israel in the past should be a foregone conclusion. My problem with what you claim is that you are trying to put two things into one, i.e., that those led to Malay are the same as Lehi and his family and that is in opposition to the scriptural record. And if you think the Lord would have allowed such a huge, gargantuum (my grandkds' word) error to enter into the Church and remain for over 100 years is beyond my most vivid imagination and as far as I am concerned once and for all, does not deserve any credence whatsoever. The Lord I know does not operate that way and it is disheartening to me to think that intelligent people can so misunderstand the simple language of the scriptural record. However, every person has the agency to believe what they choose. Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-4130008373186581882017-05-21T12:01:14.659-07:002017-05-21T12:01:14.659-07:00"A simple response here would be that in usin..."A simple response here would be that in using Moriancumer, you are outside the realm of the Book of Mormon, for the name is never given there." <br /><br />Sorry, I'm not following. Moriancumer is mentioned in Ether 2:13. I am referring to Moriancumer as a toponym, and comparing it to the toponym given to an island/peninsula in the Malay Archipelago. I realize Joseph Smith said it was also the name of the Brother of Jared, so I accept it can also be used as a personal name/title. But its usage in the Book of Mormon is as a location, most likely on the east coast of Asia (according to Nibley). I agree, and I think there is evidence of this in the identification made by Arabic geographers of a location called Qumr in the Far East.<br /><br />"In another variant, in checking the name Cumr you indicated, which is another stretch, as told in Sirat Sayf..."<br /><br />Qamar in Arabic and Qumr in Arabic are two different words. Qamar means moon. So the story you provide is about a queen named "moon". This word isn't related to the Qumr, the Biblical group that migrated east to the island of Komr around the time of the tower.<br /><br />"it is obvious you are not reading what I post, since you never comment about it but continued with your isolated narrative. What kind of discussion is that?"<br /><br />I've read dozens, if not hundreds, of your posts over the years. I read all your comments as well. I believe I have responded to any that were addressed to me. Sometimes because your comments are broken up into many parts, I might miss some, or my response might not nest properly underneath. Apologies if I missed any. - JayUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-24136438772706289102017-05-21T11:36:34.097-07:002017-05-21T11:36:34.097-07:00Unknown...for whatever it is worth, it is obvious ...Unknown...for whatever it is worth, it is obvious you are not reading what I post, since you never comment about it but continued with your isolated narrative. What kind of discussion is that?Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-68869220548147731012017-05-21T11:35:37.893-07:002017-05-21T11:35:37.893-07:00(continuing) In another variant, in checking the n...(continuing) In another variant, in checking the name Cumr you indicated, which is another stretch, as told in Sirat Sayf (vol 1 p 49), the “Curse of Ham,” which is claimed to have been the “black skin” invoked by Noah upon Ham, is referred to totally as the “Curse of Noah,” i.e., meaning Noah was cursed with a “black skin.” In Yemen today, ironically, this claim of Ham’s children being subjugated by Shem’s children, etc., is at the heart of the Yemeni-Habashi conflict, and dates back to Ham marrying Princess Qamar Shahiq after the death of Noah—supposedly she fell in love with Ham at first sight because of his “shiny black skin.” Queen Qamar Shahiq had three black children, who married white people but their children were black “by God’s will.” As the “months and years passed, all of the people of the city became black and they married their neighbors from the surrounding lands and they in turn intermarried, until all the lands became black.” A king from this land was prophesied to bring forth the religion of Islam to the world, conquer the lands of Habasha and Sudan, and subjugate their people to the descendants of Shem, son of Noah (Helen Blatherwick, Prophets, Gods and kings in Sirat Sayf ibn Dhi Yazan, Koninklijke Brill, The Netherlands, 2016, pp81-83).<br />In this “The Adventures of Sayf ibn Dhi Yazan,” there is a legend of the life and adventures of Sayf ibn Dhi Yazan, son of the Yemeni king Dhu Yazan, that tells the story of how Sayf leads his people into Egypt, diverts the Nile to its current course, then then goes on to conquer the worlds of men and jinn in the name of Islam. This legend is set in the pre-Islamic time, history is rewritten in the sira to present Egypt as born out of an exodus led by a proto-Islamic Yemeni king.<br />Are you sure you want to delve into this type of thing, and the Qur’an, to try and claim origins of the Book of Mormon people, i.e., “from whence they came”? Youi would also have a hard time selling Surat al-Qamar and his story regarding Noah when it is none of it is supported by the punishment stories narrated regarding the events (Surat al A’raf (Q7).<br />Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-57610942844199383532017-05-21T11:35:19.831-07:002017-05-21T11:35:19.831-07:00(continuing) It should be noted here, at the headi...(continuing) It should be noted here, at the heading of the etymology of the name Moriancumer in the instance cited above (Book of Mormon Onomasticon), it reads: “Until possible language affinities for Jaredite names can be determined, all suggestions for etymologies of Jaredite names must remain more speculative than substantive” (emphasis added).<br />With that in mind, let’ take a look at the name you indicated: Morian cumer does not make up the full name. It was Mahonri Moriancumer (“The Jaredites,” Juvenile Instructor, May 1, 1892, 282n) and is spelled correctly, not suggesting it was two words (BUY Religious Education, Religious Studies Center). <br />According to Joseph Smith, this was the name of the Brother of Jared, the Jaredites named the place they settled along the coast “Moriancumer.” It should also be pointed out that at the BYU Onomasticon, in the category of “variant” we find: “Spelled Morian cumer in P; since Cowdery did not capitalize cumer, perhaps shows that he intended to write the name as a single word. Moriancumer may also be a misspelling of Moriancumr, like Coriantumr.” Once again, you have taken the incorrect path for an unwarranted explanation, that supports your point of view.<br />(continued)Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-11597261687988879552017-05-21T11:35:01.183-07:002017-05-21T11:35:01.183-07:00Unknown:
Unknown: You mentioned earlier in respons...Unknown:<br />Unknown: You mentioned earlier in response to my statement that you were not using scriptural references, you wrote: “Apologies, I assumed you would already be familiar with the scriptural references, but you are correct. I should have included them. Ether 2:13 "And as they came to the sea they pitched their tents; and they called the name of the place Moriancumer; and they dwelt in tents, and dwelt in tents upon the seashore for the space of four years." Moriancumer was spelled Morian cumer in the printer's manuscript, so it appears to be two different words. Morian and Cumer. I reference the BYU Onomasticon project which suggests "Moriancumer may also be a misspelling of Moriancumr, like Coriantumr."<br />A simple response here would be that in using Moriancumer, you are outside the realm of the Book of Mormon, for the name is never given there. In this case, a correct reference would be Joseph Smith’s statement regarding a blessing name he gave in Nauvoo. <br />However, using your information, being as it is, I am quite familiar with the scriptural reference, what I am not familiar with is the distortion being used here to claim it is something it is not. The term “onomasticon” of which you speak, is relatively unknown to most people, was not a word in Joseph Smith’s time, and basically means a list of names not arranged in any manner, yet relating to the same semantic field. Some claim such lists of names dates back to Roman Emperor Augustus period (last century B.C.), and was the most common type of list prior to that. As an example, the name Nhm has been used by Book of Mormon researchers to verify “Nahom” as a place name from the region known as “Nehem” in southern Arabia (Warren P. Aston, “The Origins of the Nihm Tribe of Yemen: A Window into Arabia's Past,” Journal of Arabian Studies: Arabia, the Gulf, and the Red Sea, 4/1, 2014, pp134-148). Hugh Nibley made this connection in 1950; however, even today, this is an unknown but oft repeated “fact.”<br />(continued)Delhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08982095508142923740noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-52406000876816241052017-05-20T20:08:44.428-07:002017-05-20T20:08:44.428-07:00Ira, to assure you that I alone am not the source ...Ira, to assure you that I alone am not the source of these outrageous claims (which existed long before me) please watch this report from a legitimate news organization:<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=057TwFlGz10Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-16303966627739433462017-05-20T19:30:31.083-07:002017-05-20T19:30:31.083-07:00There was not one single grand migratory event of ...There was not one single grand migratory event of Japheth to China. There have been countless migrations from the Middle East to China over the last 5000 years. It is a well-established fact that Christianity and Judaism flourished in the East during the Book of Mormon period. These are undisputed facts backed up by archaeology, genetics, and "the records they left behind". There is substantial evidence that the Church in the East was larger than the Church in Europe during the first millennium AD. There were entire Mongol tribes in China that were Christian. There were at least 65 Jewish colonies stretching from India to China where the Kaifeng Jews had synagogues and even a temple. There are large inscribed stones in the middle of China confirming that there were indeed Semites and Christians there from, according to Tiberiu Weisz, as far back as 600 BC. He says "a literary analysis of Chinese and Hebrew sources pointed to an indirect but unmistakable link between the land of Israel and China as early as the seventh century BCE."<br /><br />http://www.covenant.idc.ac.il/en/vol1/issue3/kaifeng-stone-inscriptions-revisited.html <br /><br />These Jews still live there, and no doubt will be included in the gathering. Sorry, its not for you to disinvite them just because you have decided that there isn't a single Israelite in all of China.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-30468885220459280162017-05-20T18:36:47.268-07:002017-05-20T18:36:47.268-07:00Thats nonsense Jay - they certainly are not descen...Thats nonsense Jay - they certainly are not descendant from Shem. Shem stayed in the area around the middle east. We know that from the records that have been left behind. These people are Chinese. You have it all screwed up because you do not understand the scriptures. The scriptures trace the House of Israel and they are in the North countries and in the America's. That's scripture. The Oriental people all descend from Japheth. Not once has the gospel ever been taken to the people of China through all the ages. Why is that? Never once has even Christianity been established among these people. And you are telling me they descend from Shem! What a bunch of nonsense. They are what I told you they are - they descend from Japheth through his other sons and certainly not Shem. <br /><br />There are some who believe they descend from Ham. But that isn't true because they certainly are not black. Ham only had one son Canaan from which all the black race descend. <br /><br />The Miautso People of China descend from Japheth and they have a genealogy descent that shows this through Gomer. Other peoples in China descend from the other sons as I mentioned. <br /><br />But regardless of all this. The orientals are certainly not of the House of Israel. They will not be gathered. Again, Moroni tells you where the Lamanites are located. He didn't in anyway hint that they were located apart from this continent. He said they were here in America. The other tribes will be gathered from the North Countries as it says in D&C 133. <br /><br />Jacob 5 tells you where they went as well. The Nephites and Lamanites were taken to a good spot of ground. The good spot had no people there unlike the Orientals. Malyasia would have had people there on the peninsula. The lost tribes were taken to a poor spot of ground or the nethermost which means poor. The reason it was poor is because there were people there and they polluted the tribes. Hence their apostasy. That would have happened to the Lamanties/Nephites if they were in Malaysia which they were not. There were people there who are Oriental/Chinese. <br />Your sources are all nonsense and that is quite obvious. iterryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14836783863542965577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-75953755592092722842017-05-20T10:30:13.487-07:002017-05-20T10:30:13.487-07:00Ira, that's not accurate history, at least it ...Ira, that's not accurate history, at least it hasn't been since the turn of the 19th century. You are using one blanket term "oriental" to describe well over 5 billion people of completely different genetic composition and dumping them into the same bucket because you think the are all descendants of Japheth, over 5000 years ago.<br /><br />There are countless volumes describing the "orientals" as Shem, this is a tradition that goes back a very very lone time. Kircher and Webb and hundreds of other commentators speculated that the Chinese came from Shem. Much of this comes from the belief that Joktan, son of Eber (Hebrews), descendant of Shem (Semite) went east into the hills. Are you certain the "orientals" do not, in part, descend from Joktan in any way? If so, how do you know this?<br /><br />Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-20926813872836060632017-05-20T08:46:09.012-07:002017-05-20T08:46:09.012-07:00Ira, I am not the one making it up. The Bnei Menas...Ira, I am not the one making it up. The Bnei Menashe have been calling themselves Josephites since before I was born. American protestants have been claiming the Karen of Burma were Manasseh since before Mormonism. Arabic historians have been claiming the Malay were Shem since before America was discovered. Christian writers were claiming that the Malay Peninsula was inhabited by the Blessed Ones (Rechabites) since the 2nd century AD. Even the Bible says that Solomon sent ships to Ophir, which most agree was not north or west, but east through the Indian Ocean. <br /><br />If you aren't going to believe the writings of historians and geographers of the last two millennia, I don't think I'll ever be able to change your mind. <br /><br />I've provided evidence to support my arguments, I can't force you to accept them.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-88288889797928066622017-05-20T08:25:11.494-07:002017-05-20T08:25:11.494-07:00You still are ignoring the main fact here that the...You still are ignoring the main fact here that the majority of the Lamanites/Nephites lived in America period. That is Moroni said. There maybe a few Lamanites somewhere else but they aren't part of the main group that landed here in America. That's what this blog is about and you can't prove your point because you have departed from scripture to make it. <br /><br />The people of Malaysia are NOT of the House of Israel. That's complete and utter nonsense. They are descendant from Japheth through his son Javan. The Chinese were once known as the people of Cathay or Kittim. Kittim was the son of Javan. Some of the descendants of Japheth moved north and some east east. The descendants of Japheth settled in Western Europe but also in the far east in China and that includes the Malay Archipelago and various islands of the ocean.<br /><br />This is a known fact. And no rabbi can come along and tell me that somehow Manasseh settled there at any point in time. The scriptures clearly tell us the lost tribes went north. North Jay not south or east. One small family were brought to America and that was Lehi and his associates. This is recorded in the records of the nations. You just can't go out and make things up like this and expect thinking people to believe it. <br /><br />When the time comes that the tribes are all brought in to the New Jerusalem then they will be identified fully and they will be gathered. The promises of God are to only one people on this planet and that is to the House of Israel. They are the ones that are gathered and not the descendants of any of the other tribes. Japheth is not gathered, neither is Ham. Only a portion of Shem is gathered. The Arabs are not gathered for example and in fact are destroyed as it says in Obadiah 18. A few Christians are gathered out in the end but they never join with the House of Israel. In the end of time at the battle of Gog and Magog. The bottom line is we know who these people descend from. And we know from scripture that the Indians of North and South America are descendants of the Lamanites. That’s a known fact Jay. <br /><br />If South America is clearly correct then why not focus on it rather than the descendants of the Chinese who descend through Japheth? <br />iterryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14836783863542965577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-83708116984227425922017-05-19T21:51:36.135-07:002017-05-19T21:51:36.135-07:00"But great are the promises of the Lord unto ..."But great are the promises of the Lord unto them who are upon the isles of the sea; wherefore as it says isles, there must needs be more than this, and they are inhabited also by our brethren."<br /><br />Ira, South America is clearly correct, but there must be more than that. There must be.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-31652747056550361612017-05-19T21:12:27.704-07:002017-05-19T21:12:27.704-07:00No I'm not - the scriptures are clear that you...No I'm not - the scriptures are clear that you are not on the right track. Moroni said so and all the scriptures say so. Those Rabbi's simply don't know what they are talking about. You obviously do not understand scripture or you wouldn't be running after these spurious sources to prove your point. Stick with the revelations my friend and you'll find the right answers. <br /><br />The South American model fits everything perfectly. You don't have to bend anything to make it fit as you are doing. You need to reject that model of yours because it doesn't work. It's not even close to working. And you won't be able to convince me because it violates so many scripture and that's the final point. It simply can't be correct. <br />iterryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14836783863542965577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-12573611355929581642017-05-19T20:21:57.647-07:002017-05-19T20:21:57.647-07:00I mentioned before that if you don't agree wit...I mentioned before that if you don't agree with the model, that's perfectly fine. But don't throw the baby out with the bath water.<br /><br />You are throwing the baby out with the bath water.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-90972162175023447832017-05-19T17:04:46.637-07:002017-05-19T17:04:46.637-07:00Jay, The rabbi's don't have a clue as to w...Jay, The rabbi's don't have a clue as to where Manasseh is located and who they are. Yes I am very confident that the right place has been found. We have far more revelation on this subject and we understand those revelations much more than the Rabbi's. After all the Jews are in apostasy and actually will be gathered at the very last. They simply have it wrong. Moroni tells you where they are located and they are not found in Malaysia. It's as simple as that. You have to stick to the revelation's Jay and not go running after all this other garbage. <br /><br />We have revelation that tells us what we need to know about where they are located. The reason we know is because at some point they will be gathered. That gathering has not started yet and won't start until the 144,000 are called to do the work as prophesied in Revelation. Ephraim is the only tribe gathered right now and Ephraim will gather Manasseh to the New Jerusalem when the time comes. That time has not come and won't come until 3-1/2 years into the Tribulation. There are a few Indians in South America have joined the Church but that isn't the gathering as prophesied in D&C 133 and Ezekiel 47:1-12. That event is still future and I assure you that it won't be from Malaysia because they are descendant from Japheth and not the House of Israel. <br />Iraiterryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14836783863542965577noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5948352943362975805.post-713035220467437312017-05-19T09:24:14.142-07:002017-05-19T09:24:14.142-07:00All these articles are from last week:
http://for...All these articles are from last week:<br /><br />http://forward.com/fast-forward/371895/102-immigrants-from-india-ready-for-normal-life-in-israel/<br /><br />http://m.stljewishlight.com/news/world/article_ea82d97c-32ff-56bb-9bd0-a3ec4fcd0acb.html?mode=jqm<br /><br />http://www.jpost.com/Breaking-News/102-olim-from-India-set-to-leave-absorption-center-and-settle-down-490727<br /><br />http://www.timesofisrael.com/102-bnei-menashe-set-to-leave-absorption-center-and-settle-down/<br /><br />http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/229575<br /><br />http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/headlines-breaking-stories/1275343/120-indian-bnei-menashe-officially-join-israeli-society.html<br /><br />http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/229575Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03677339672381456270noreply@blogger.com