Continuing
from the previous post regarding Alan C. Miner’s book we have been asked to
comment upon. In the previous post, we discussed some of Miner’s comments in
the first couple of pages of his work. Following we are still on page 2:
All
this time, following the battle at Cumorah, Moroni expected to be killed at any
moment. He had no guarantee on any longevity of life beyond Cumorah, but the
Lord granted him a longer life to fulfill his assignment to hide the plates so
the Lamanites could not destroy them.
Sometime
between 401 A.D. and 421 A.D., Moroni finishes the record he “had supposed not
to have written more” (Moroni 1:1). How long it took him to write what is now
known as the Book of Moroni is not known; however, we can conclude he finished
his writing in 420 or 421 A.D., for his final remarks, which are addressed to the Lamanites, he
begins with: “I would that they should know that more than four hundred and
twenty years have passed away since the sign was given of the coming of Christ”
(Moroni 10:1).
From
this we cannot conclude as Ainsworth and Miner have, that Nephites survived
this battle and track down period. In fact, Moroni’s own writing tells us no
one did but himself. Thus, it should be noted that Morolni twice makes mention of the fact
that he is "alone." In Mormon
8:3 he says, "And my father also was killed by them, and I even remain alone
to write the sad tale of destruction of my people. But behold, they are gone, and I fulfil the
commandment of my father." In
Mormon 8:5 he says, "Behold, my father hath made this record, and he hath
written the intent thereof. And behold,
I would write it also if I had room upon the plates, but I have not; and ore I
have none, for I am alone. My
father hath been slain in battle, and all my kinsfolk, and I have not friends
nor whither to go."
However, the precise and clear language of Moroni is not
sufficient for Miner, who goes on to state: “In respect to Moroni's writing
assignment, the phrase "I even remain alone to write the sad tale"
apparently means that Moroni was the only official Nephite scribe left…However,
the idea that Moroni was the only Nephite left is a little bit
questionable. Moroni 1:2 lets us know
that at a later date Moroni says, "they (the Lamanites) put to death every
Nephite that will not deny the Christ."
Therefore, the meaning of the phrase "I am alone" probably
means that all the other major Nephite leaders had been put to death by the
Lamanites. The words in Mormon 8:5, "my father hath been slain in battle,
and all my kinfolk" implies further that Mormon and Moroni were probably
part of a great family unit that shouldered much spiritual and secular
responsibility in the Nephite society.
The phrase, "I have not friends nor whither to go" might imply
the lack of righteous covenant people to whom Moroni could go for help.”
On the other hand, “I even remain alone,” might mean
exactly what it implies—Moroni was the last Nephite alive. It is always amazing
to us that so many theorists simply will not take the scriptural record to mean
what it says—they are constantly trying to tell us something else than what is
being said is meant.
Miner quotes John L. Sorenson (p2), who also weighs in on
this matter, stating: “the record came to an end because the lineage did, not
because an entire civilization ceased…Naturally, large numbers of people of
Nephite descent had never consented to flee their lands in the first place
(Mormon 2:7-8), but had switched allegiance and renounced their old beliefs and
allegiance rather than move out (Moroni 1:2).”
However, what Miner and Sorenson seem to forget is that
the Nephites had no choice—they either fled with the Nephite army or they were
killed by the approaching Lamanite hordes. As Mormon tells us: “And it came to pass that we did again
take to flight, and those whose flight was swifter than the Lamanites' did
escape, and those whose flight did not exceed the Lamanites' were swept down
and destroyed” (Mormon 5:7). Of all those Nephites who remained alive, Mormon
tells us that in 384 A.D., “we had gathered in all the remainder of our people
unto the land of Cumorah” (Mormon 6:5).
All the remainder of our people!
That
doesn’t leave any room for others to not have participated in this final battle
as Miner and Sorenson and other Mesoamerican theorists want to claim.
It
can also be said, that on another occasion, Miner states (p6): “After writing an epilogue to
his father's abridgment (see Mormon 8:1-13), the amount of time that elapsed
before Moroni returned to the sacred depository to once again take the stylus
in hand is unclear. However, when Moroni
returned to the sacred site and removed the plates of Mormon from their place
of concealment, he engraved a brief
affirmation that he was the same person who had previously buried the sacred
records. He wrote: "And I am the
same who hideth up this record unto the Lord" (Mormon 8:14). Without that transitional sentence the reader
would be lost as to who was writing on the plates following the previous
benedictory conclusion.”
The problem with such writing is that Miner assumes
things and writes them into his narrative as though they are fact, when in reality
they are his opinion. Take, for example the statement “…he was the same person
who had previously buried the sacred records,” when in reality, there is no
mention of the records being buried. Where else they might have been is not the
point—the problem is that the reader is left to accept the comment as fact
when, in reality, Miner does not know the records had been buried, nor does he
even know that Moroni had not carried the records with him in his travels or
hiding during that elapsed time. In fact, the term “bury” and “buried” are not
found at all in either the writings of Mormon (Book of Mormon) or of Moroni
(Book of Moroni). At one point, Moroni says he is going to “write and hide up
the records in the earth” (Mormon 8:4), but does not tell us in what sequence,
or in what time. Did he write, hide them up and then get them again, and write
more and hide them up? We simply do not know.
In addition, Miner providers us once again with his own
view and not what the scriptural record tells us or even suggests. He
states (pp15-16): “Apparently by using the phrase, "this north
country" (Ether 1:1), Moroni seems to imply that he was writing from a
location somewhere in the north country, or in other words, from the land
northward (the place where both the Nephites and the Jaredites were
destroyed)…we are told elsewhere in the Book of Mormon that the final battle
site of the Jaredites (the hill Ramah) and the final battle site of the
Nephites (the hill Cumorah) were the same (Mormon 8:1-4). We are also told that Mormon "hid up in
the hill Cumorah all the records" which had been entrusted to him except
apparently the abridgement (Mormon 6:6).
Therefore, the fact that Moroni is making this record of the Jaredites
seems to imply that he has returned to the hill Cumorah, located in "this
north country."
There is no suggestion that Moroni returned to the hill
Cumorah at any time. There is no suggestion that Moroni hid the records he
possessed in the hill Cumorah at that or any time in antiquity. That he did
deposit the records in a hill in western New York prior to the time he
instructed Joseph Smith to obtain them from the ground is obvious, but it
is not as obvious that the hill in New York was the same hill as the one
mentioned in the scriptural record. In fact, as we have stated here numerous
times, there are little, if any, comparisons that can be drawn at all between the hill mentioned in the record and the one in New York.
(See
the next post, “Step by Step Through the Book of Mormon – Part III,” for more
information on our view of Alan C. Miner’s book that we have been asked to
evaluate by a Reader of our blog)
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Del- I appreciate how you faithfully stick to the scriptural record.
ReplyDeleteNephi saw in vision that his people would be destroyed.
1 Nephi 15:5
And it came to pass that I was overcome because of my afflictions, for I considered that mine afflictions were great above all, because of the destruction of my people, for I had beheld their fall.
Nephi's nephew Enos prayed for the record to be preserved if the Nephites would be destroyed. And he prayed it would be restored to the Lamanites. Why not pray for it to be restored to a remnant of the Nephites if it was only going to be a partial destruction.
Enos 1:13
And now behold, this was the desire which I desired of him—that if it should so be, that my people, the Nephites, should fall into transgression, and by any means be destroyed, and the Lamanites should not be destroyed, that the Lord God would preserve a record of my people, the Nephites; even if it so be by the power of his holy arm, that it might be brought forth at some future day unto the Lamanites, that, perhaps, they might be brought unto salvation—
Alma prophesied the Nephites would become extinct
Alma 45:11
Yea, and then shall they see wars and pestilences, yea, famines and bloodshed, even until the people of Nephi shall become extinct--
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ReplyDeleteTo me, Mormon 6:6 makes me think the Hill Cumorah referenced in the Book of Mormon is not the same hill in upstate NY now referred to as the Hill Cumorah.
ReplyDeleteMormon stated:
I made this record out of the plates of Nephi, and hid up in the hill Cumorah all the records which had been entrusted to me by the hand of the Lord, save it were these few plates which I gave unto my son Moroni.
All the plates were hid in the Hill Cumorah referenced in the Book of Mormon except the plates Moroni took with him. So the Hill Joseph was directed to in upstate NY likely was not the same as the Hill Cumorah referenced in the Book of Mormon-else where are the rest of the plates that Mormon hidin tthe Hill Cumorah referenced in the Book of Mormon.
David: Well pointed out. Thank you.
ReplyDeleteAccording to the 1828 Webster's Dictionary: EXTINCT', adjective [Latin extinctus. See Extinguish.
ReplyDelete1. Extinguished; put out; quenched; as, fire, light or a lamp is extinct
2. Being at an end; having no survivor; as, a family or race is extinct
3. Being at an end; having ceased. The enmity between the families is extinct
My days are extinct Job 17:1.
4. Being at an end, by abolition or disuse; having no force; as, the law is extinct
So.. I guess in 1828 extinct meant extinct.. as in NO SURVIVORS. And the Spirit testified it was correct. I guess Sorenson, Miner and Ainsworth are using a dictionary that has a different definition of extinct.